To Rob, about N. clipeata:
I know there are 3 clones around Europe and in the mass production around the globe. Then I think there are more clones in Indonesia and Malaysia, if I'm not wrong, of course collected not exactely in a legal way, or obtained from poachers in old times, when the dangerous situation of this species wasn't in front of the eyes of most people. If I catch someone who has these "new" (I don't want to use negative words) clones, I would not buy them, unless they are going to die in the hands of this person. I would explain this guy that these plants are of low commercial value, but very high conservation value. I would try to find some place or institution where these plants can be collected all together and kept protected, possibly with the 3 "old" clones. If the guy who owns the plants doesn't want to do that himself, I would ask the price and maybe ask the cp community to give a contribute. But again, IF the plants are going to die in the hands of this person. If this person is a nep grower, let's just help him to keep the plants alive, let's buy the 3 "old" clones and let's keep all the plants close so that when they flower we make seeds. Or, in any case, let's freeze the pollen when a male flowers. Knowing more details would help
Sooxiwei, of course in all the world's associations happens what you said (fighting, politics etc), it's natural in a large group of people, it also happens in every single forum I know, regarding any kind of topic, it's called "community"
But the worse mistake I've seen people doing here in my country, and in other countries, in societies, in politics, in the world etc, is saying "eeh, let's wait, let's see, time is needed, we'll see, maybe...". That's the tunnel that brings to the great Nothing
As you suggest, start a new initiative, here are some easy ideas for a good start, for you or anybody who wants to start (guys, I would found the Malaysian cp Society myself, but I'm italian, come on, I'm sure you can do it yourself!
):
-open a new forum, in malaysian language, dedicated to all the growers of carnivorous plants in Malaysia. Post a message in other malaysian plant forums saying that you just created this forum.
-do the same thing on facebook, again in malaysian language.
-when you're all friends, organize a meeting somewhere, possibly somewhere where there is a cp collection. A nice weekend, eating and talking all together etc.
-once it's clear which people are the most interested, enthusiastic, organizative etc, form some kind of committee. You can make a magazine sent by email, or with photocopies, collecting money with internet, organize seed banks, conservation projects, up to your fantasy and enthusiasm. It only takes a few hours a month, it's just about enjoying a passion.
-arguing is very frequent in these communities, especially at the beginning, when new equilibers need to be set and everybody wants to speak and be right. So be very patient and don't destroy or ruin the whole community, leaving just because you argue with some people. Stay there, give your help, or wait in silence, but stay there. Remember: the longer you stay, even in silence, the more you will be respected in the future and the more you won't need to stay in silence anymore
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