Writing a Paper 4 a speech and need some help

[CN]

Hi All,
I am Writing a Paper On Nepenthes Poaching, and I need some help.
I need to get some feedback on this subject, some facts as well because I have to do a speech on this all as well.
So if you guys could help me with your input on this matter, as well as your firm beliefs.
Some of you are more involved with this matter then others so all you Now the better .

Thanks Daren

[arvin555]

CN, you want us to just write down our opinions about the topic? Anything goes? Rants are okay?

Or maybe you want to put in some guide questions or at least some initial questions to get us going?

TTFN
Arvin

[nyala]

Daren,
Can you explain the purpose of your speech? What information that you need exactly?

Arvin,
I agree with you, let's us share our opinion about that.


regards,

John

[sooxiwei]

it's the matter of poaching vs collecting...

As the matter of fact, some take from the wild(mass taking) for commercial purposes, that's an act of poaching, fact: it's not so good to talk about this here as it's sort of sensitive issue which could hurt certain personal if he/she perceived it from a stereotypical view-nepenthes is normally saw in certain market in south east asia, as you can see in some picture around the forum, mostly pictures of Thai market where those people do mass collecting from the wild, wipe out everything including the seeds just to sell at market, that's certainly unethical, therefore poaching

The other side of poaching is collecting, if there are no collecting, do you think you are going to have nepenthes in your garden? some people take a few plants from the wild, try to propagate it and spread the plants around at reasonable low price, that's collecting instead of poaching since not much damage is done to the original habitat, fact: those tissue culture company like the famous Borneo Exotic, if it wasn't them, N. Campanulata wouldn't be so common to us.
Another case, when you are at the situation where you are standing in front of a land full of nepenthes, at the same time, the habitat is being destroyed by whatever heavy commercial vehicle for development purposes, taking whatever is there before it's going to be destroyed is a form of collecting to me, which is ethical as well to me, it's very common in south east asia as countries are sacrificing almost everything for "development", if you perceived it as "poaching", well you can probably say goodbye to all species of nepenthes as development is going crazy around this region, there's no permanent protected or reserved forest in this region...

Conclusion: Every one has their own view, don't just take whatever is being told, do some logical thinking as one's perception might not be appropriate to be apply to a different situation, when taking from wild is called poaching from one side of the world, think of the situation, that side of the world might have all sort of laws/rules strictly implemented, greenery being protected, but this side of the world, there's law/rule, but not even implemented, bribery and corruption is what it offers(thanks to "democracy"). Waiting for action to be taken? Probably in another million years time, if we don't save it, no one will...

hope this help

[CN]

Sorry for my absence I was in the Hospital.

Re: Writing a Paper 4 a speech and need some help
CN, you want us to just write down our opinions about the topic? Anything goes? Rants are okay?

Or maybe you want to put in some guide questions or at least some initial questions to get us going?

TTFN
Arvin

Yes Rants opinions. between Collecting as well as poaching .
this is for a class project speech

Daren

[arvin555]

By the way I think we had some kind of discussion about the topic here some time ago, please do a search as well.

So far for me I have concluded just my opinion the following:

1. Getting them from known protected areas such as sactuaries and nature preserves are automatically called Poaching!

2. Getting them from roadsides and stuff that are unprotected as long as for your own collection purpose is "collecting". I don't think this is a big sin, in fact if I had the opportunity I'd probably do it myself.

But the collection style also has to be discussed. if you uproot, then it's not great practice, if you take a few cuttings, I think it is an acceptable practice. Why? You pull off the plant, the plant is gone and it might die on collector's hands, if you make a cutting, chances are your cutting will live and the mother plant will live, even if your cutting does not live, you can still have a chance to go back and collect in the future because the plant is still there, hopefully.

*except in countries or areas where there are laws against collection without a special permit, etc. then if you collect without a permit, it's still poaching, except that we are not going to call you evil! It's a grey area I guess.

3. There was talk here about maybe rescuing Nepenthes which the road clearers hack off every year when they clear the roadsides of vegetation. This is basically "rescue" and not poaching or collection, but way difficult to control or arrange. In fact there are problems too because this can be abused and used by poachers as an excuse... "Oh they were from roadside clearings so we collected them" excuse, but really they were not.

4. Collecting Some, but not all seed capsules in my opinion maybe gives the least impact, but being that most nepenthes are males, that even this is not very good to do often or by many people, because you might end up killing that natural propagation method of the species. Imagine 10 hikers getting one seed capsule each, then one plant will end up with very little capsules left

5. I personally do not agree with the idea, that because I am collecting for personal collection that I am helping make sure that the species is protected in future, by helping propagation, etc. Nope... why?

a. Most Nurseries are only interested in seeds, so collect those and send to them, now that is helping in commercial propagation and protection.

b. You cut the plant, uproot it, etc. you are not helping you just collected for yourself, but you can't propagate it yourself and make it available in commercial quantity, so you are using it as an excuse to collect. call a spade a spade and just say I collected for my own collection.

6. Rescue collection, if an area is going to be developed or in danger of construction, etc. and you know there are plants there, then I agree that the best thing to do is to collect them, either re located them or put them in your collection. Better to ask for permit, but yeah often it is just red tape, and you need to act quickly. In this case, you are a hero!

7. Collection, no matter what and where and selling the collected plants is in my opinion poaching!

My two cents.

TTFN
Arvin